Behind the Badge: Kristen Linton on the Resilience and Unity of Police Families

Speaker 1: 0:15

Welcome to today's episode of Enduring the Badge Podcast. I'm host Jerry Dean Lund and if you haven't already done so, please take out your phone and hit that subscribe button. I don't want you to miss an upcoming episode. And hey, while your phone's out, please give us a rating and review. On whichever platform you listen to this podcast on, such as iTunes, apple Podcasts and Spotify. It helps this podcast grow and the reason why, when this gets positive ratings and reviews, those platforms like Apple Podcasts and Spotify show this to other people that never listened to this podcast before, and that allows our podcast to grow and make a more of an impact on other people's lives. So if you would do that, I would appreciate that from the bottom of my heart. Excuse me, welcome to Enduring the Badge Podcast. My very special guest today is Kristin Linton. How you doing, kristin?

Speaker 2: 1:01

All right, thank you for having me, yeah thank you for being on.

Speaker 1: 1:04

I really appreciate it. Kristin, can you introduce yourself to the audience?

Speaker 2: 1:10

Sure, so I'm here because I'm a police wife. I'm also a mother of two boys. They're age six and nine. We're from Los Angeles my husband's Metro police here. He's been on for 16 years. We've been married for 10, and I love saying that, like we're happily married at 10 years, it took us a while to get to that like happy, joyful stage. I feel like the first five years was a little tense, but mostly I started like coming out, I should say, as a police wife, like more publicly in 2021, 2020 was a rough year and it honestly changed me and I started posting like funny reels on Instagram about police wife life because I loved the mom reels but I was like I want to do my own thing. And then it did really well Like I created this amazing community and I honestly had never had like a ton of police wife friends. So that was really cool on just relating. And then it's just grown from there and like spreading kind of. I love telling stories and writing. I write for work, I work full time as a professor, I write academically and about research. It's not the most exciting thing to everyone in the whole world, it's very different. But like when I write for my police wife stuff, I just get to have fun and I try not to overthink it and that always does the best honestly and just be like raw about what really happens and, please, five seem to really like relate to that. So I wrote a devotional book with like 42 stories of what I call like our our growth moments and our marriage on my husband, mine and but moments that I thought were like relatable. So I started with that and then this last year I wrote two kids books for police kids specifically about specific moments in time that were also relatable to like police kids and and their families, of course, and I wrote that with Michelle Johnson, who is also police wife. She illustrated it and I was key. I'm not a drawer illustrator and I want to give her credit for that as well.

Speaker 1: 3:08

Thank you, wow, yeah, that's awesome, let's. Let's talk about those books a little bit and I'll let you choose which one you want to talk about first.

Speaker 2: 3:16

So okay. So the first one wrote was like a moment in time, so it's called boots by the door and like any police wife or police kid would know, like we look for the boots by the door, to know that like daddy's home or mommy's home with here Police husband, I suppose, or police wife without wife, and I talked about in that book, like my kids coming down the stairs and like seeing the boots by the door and getting excited, and it's two little boys told through the lens of like one of them, the older one and the older one like trips over the boots, but then he's happy and then he's like daddy's home. Yay, this is so exciting. Daddy works night shift. Rick, my husband worked for eight years on night shift, swing shift, kind of super used to like we don't really see him. He comes home in the middle of the night. We see him later in the morning, maybe afternoon, and they also look for his car outside, which is like common as well. But and then, though, like later, we're all like sitting at breakfast time, the mom and the boys, but obviously it's told real experience. And then the dad come, like they hear him upstairs, but they think like at first, like the little boys imagine like it's a robber upstairs and then they hear him walking on the stairs and they describe him as like having Hulk footsteps, like walking down the stairs and they get excited. Daddy's home but then they find out he has to work that day and that's like a really common thing of like little kids. I try to keep like a whiteboard calendar in our house that my boy it's at their levels, like low to the ground and we write like when daddy's working. But my six year old still is learning like calendar and like what's today, what's tomorrow, and keep you track alone as an adult of the police calendar and ever changing schedule is like hard right. So, kids, it's like it's whiteboard because we get a race and change it. But yeah, I feel like they never really know like is daddy working or not, even though maybe my eight year old could do it now. But yeah, so they find out he's working and then like the mom kind of says like talks about all the fun things that we're going to do today anyway, and then they say goodbye to daddy. So it's a little bit, it's like a little emotional, but I think a lot of people say like this is my life, like that's so cool to see it in a kids book and there are funny parts we hope like. And then they imagine their dad like going and like fighting bad guys I think that's how it ends after he leaves for work so like just through the eyes of a little boy what they imagine their police dad does. So I try to keep it humorous, but it is a little bit like people have said, like it makes them cry. I'll tell you I actually wrote it because I read this book. I feel like I have. I'm like looking at the shelf over there trying to think of the name of it, but it's a book about the military. I'll email you after I can think of it. Yeah, really good for military families, and even I really did too. It was like such. It was a story told from a little kid. I think the author is Barbara Collins, so maybe you've heard of it. But it's like and the little kids saying, like their dad goes off to war and he imagines like what's happening with his dad and then his dad comes back and like it's a very emotional, but it was like wow. To see it in a kids book was kind of cool, because I would imagine like it might bring up conversations for kids of things to talk about. But at the end of our book we have like little like conversation starters and little tips of like like the whiteboard calendar idea that we have to help kids like kind of keep track of the schedule on their own too. So yeah, that's the first one.

Speaker 1: 6:52

I like that. I like. I like the talking points at the end. Is this something that when you wrote it, you like envisioned like a parent reading to their child or something?

Speaker 2: 7:01

Is that how you've kind of came up with the book and yeah, yeah for sure, because actually the military, when I'm talking about we got it from the library and then, of course, like I saw it was like this looks interesting, brought it home and read it with my boys. I don't know that they like got it the same way I did, if that makes sense, especially that one, because it's a little different lifestyle, but but, yeah, ours is a little bit shorter, so it is designed for little kids, like the other one I'm talking about is longer. And then I read it with my boys and they were like that isn't because I told them it's inspired by us, like that is an inspire by us, that is us, like that's a good point. But, also it's interesting because the illustrator has two little boys too, so it was kind of like amazing like even when she sketched the boots, they were exactly like the same boots you know like and I never sent her picture. So it's kind of amazing, like working with someone I never met her in life, in real life, I should say. So, yeah, I definitely imagined like it being read with your kids and then maybe it would spark conversations, but maybe not, maybe they just see themselves in it and that's kind of cool too. You know, like I think what I've learned, like with stories I share, is like it's relatable and it makes you feel less alone and that's super cool and that's all. Like you don't really need to have the tips at the end maybe or anything like that, but just to feel like, oh, that's me in this book and that's cool.

Speaker 1: 8:21

So no, I really do like the like the points at the end that are bringing up some discussion, because I think we discount what our kids often feel or we don't really know, and maybe that's because we don't really ask and we make a lot of assumptions, right, Because they don't really have any control of when mom and dad's coming home. And especially you know someone's worked in shift work and really understand so I could, you know that's that leads to the excitement of seeing them, but then probably knowing you know he's not going to be here, he's going to be here, like that also maybe is some security to them as well. So the talking points are probably really, really important as a parent just to like go go through those to make sure your kids can kind of understand you know how life really looks.

Speaker 2: 9:10

Yeah, yeah, and I feel like it's funny, like as your kids get older, like lately, my boys are on this thing where they're like tell me a police story, I want to know a police story. They tell Rick, and then they want me to tell stories, because I know some little point, the big ones, the big moments or something. But sometimes they're like well, really, that's like daddy's story to tell, Like, but yeah, so lately they want us to. They want him to tell like an actually something that happened at work. And then Maverick, my son, he's eight, he's like a math boy, he loves math and he's always like he said the other day how many people have you arrested?

Speaker 3: 9:43

Dad knows like yeah, I want to know.

Speaker 2: 9:44

It's not like I don't know. Thank you樊勝. Tom, let's talk about this Olive's story. Yeah, I think it's interesting as they get older, like the newer questions or what they're aware of. And then we live in an LA, southern California super liberal so we kind of like there was a story I wanted to share like early on that kind of opened my eyes to like things that they might experience in public school or like just being around other people that, like our kids do go to private school and we're really blessed to be able to do that. It's a small Christian private school with like a lot of fire and police officer families and very supportive of police family and like I'm so grateful because I was just my husband I took Leonidas, our younger son, to music class. He was just, he was like a toddler, preschool age, and Maverick was there too and my husband's like dancing around her son like having fun, which is awesome, and but he carries like so off duty carries and that's kind of a probably a weird thing like in California you don't see it as much in Southern California, in LA anyway but he does try to like keep his shirts long and it's covered but he's dancing, so I guess someone spotted it. So this class we're going was like a trial class and it was through the parks and record and like I was supposed to sign up after and I was having issues. Anyway, I couldn't like register for this thing and I get a call like two weeks later from parks and rec, like a representative from there, and she says this is kind of awkward for me to ask, but that person that was with you? Is that your husband? Is that you know your kids dad? I was like yeah. And then she says that another mom believes that she saw him with a gun. And I was like, oh yeah, he's a cop, it's legal. It's legal here in California. Like he's an act, he's a police officer. And she says, well, is he on duty? Was he on duty? And I said no, but like they're always on duty, which is something that's like really you know, like the way he's trained is like he should be prepared to intervene no matter where he is, and like that's why he carries and he always has it on his person. Like once we had kids, like that was something we agreed, like he doesn't put it up and for a guy and for guys. I'm sure it's heavy and annoying, but it was like until our boys we feel like are comfortable enough and old enough, but like even their friends over, like I just don't know, that somebody, so he has it on him all the time. And so anyway, yeah, and she was like, well, kenny, not next time if you were to come back. And I was like no, I mean like he's legally allowed to anyway. And then my husband's like Well, they can also say like no, we're not going to, like they can make their own rules. So, yeah, so we never went back to that, but it was just like awkward. And so I mean we found like other, I feel like places and spaces that are like where I feel like people just kind of get us as a police family and that, you know, of course, just feel like how, how could you be scared, like this guy's dancing around this kid, like he's not trying to hurt anybody, but anyway, it was weird. Know, like well, he could show you his badge next time, or like everybody there, so they know, or whatever. But then I was like never mind, but yeah, and I hear from other places here locally, like if their kids go to public school, like they are scared of what they're going to hear about their dad, and I feel really lucky, like someday they will hear that our kids and right now they're young and they're kind of protected right now.

Speaker 1: 13:14

So that's sad to get to that point. You know that you're afraid to legally carry or because of what people are going to think, and most people carry don't really care what other people think, so that's good too. But yeah, that you're trained. You're trained to act all the time, and that's I mean. Why wouldn't you want someone? They're protecting yourself, but that's just how I look at life, and you know. And then people frown upon people wearing blue line shirts or red line shirts, or just there's always got to be a problem, I feel like and that's probably shouldn't say always, but quite often someone wants to make an issue out of out of something, and I don't know why people want to live their lives like that. It just seems very not enjoyable.

Speaker 2: 14:06

Yeah, I agree, yeah, and that's like in 2020. I think this was even before that. But like I work at a liberal state university and there was like faculty writing F the police on Facebook and just like really immature statements, that and like offensive right to. I feel like my defensiveness and police like grew over time, like when, as I was exposed because it's like, oh my gosh, like I didn't know, my husband gets this like all the time at work. You know like and I even about me personally, but I got like super offended and yeah. So anyway, that was tough and yeah, I just don't, I'm not, I don't want my kids exposed that. I mean I know they will be someday but hopefully, hopefully they'll be more educated. I feel like living with the police officer. You become more educated on the realities of like what they actually do and I feel like more people if they knew, like that you know you are first responders to the first one there and you do like CPR and you do all these crazy things like you deal with suicidal ideation, like all these things we've never think of. And then the amount of people that you do help and the people are thankful like that that happens every day for guys to not just out like arresting people and making people upset.

Speaker 1: 15:24

So yeah, I mean they're. They're humans, right, wanting to do good and doing good, you know, through through their day. I mean there's always a few bad apples. We always say that. I mean in anything clearly immature faculty members writing things about the police, that's, you know, kind of goes hand in hand, like that's. I don't understand it. I probably never will understand it. You know, being in law enforcement and firefighting and stuff like that, I'll never understand the, the hate that just comes to the people for wanting to serve other people. Do you foresee maybe in one of your, your books that you may like write it for some of the, maybe a teenage version of something that may be encountering, like some of these things starting to come out like, oh, your dad's a police officer and I hate police officers and type of type of issues.

Speaker 2: 16:23

Yeah, I know it's funny because my son is eight and he's a little. He's a little preteen already with his behavior and everything. And yeah, and Michelle asked that like there was this, what it still exists. It's like Not like something for dummies, but it's like a teen book and you read them and they're little like lessons or stories, forgetting the name of it. But she was recommending that and and actually I thought of like how my sons are asking like, hey, daddy, tell me a police story. So he has a bunch of stories and in this memory that he wrote this last year which is so cool. It's called why is everything wet? His dad was a police officer and his dad was actually fixed. Dad was shot in the head at domestic violence call when Rick was like five or six years old, but he did go back to work. He survived, but like he did sustain a head injury and brain and you know head injury I guess you could say and like for the rest of his life, like it was different for sure, and we just lost him a couple years ago. I feel like Rick writing that book was like he writes about his dad, like being a kid and growing up with him and then his own police work and like Tells a ton of stories from his actual police work. But what's interesting is some of those stories and it's suddenly written for adults, someone I'm sorry for that, so, but some of those stories I'll hear him start the story to tell my kids and I'm like, oh, this one like is not appropriate with the kids. And then he'll switch it. Like there's the one where the guy has a condom but he switches it to a diaper. To know, like, actually like if I could pull some of those like because there's no. You see eight stories in there too where he's like face things he was a part of like I don't know if you heard of Dorner that this guy, this was like ten years ago probably, but it was a retired LAPD officer and he was also a veteran and he started like Hunting down current Family members of LAPD officers themselves. But during that time was like all up in the news and there was like I read it was in Hawaii at the time or long distance, I think we're engaged or married, you can't remember. But one of those and I I was like that was my first time seeing hate comments Because people were like, oh, good for him, like good for Dorner to like do it. And I was like whoa, that was my first time being exposed. But anyway, so back to so there are stories in there about police hate. So I feel like if I asked him, I was like already like could I pull from these? And like make a more PG? Because I think Someone it was had emailed me that like do you have stories of like what do officers actually do besides what you see on the news? And I was like yeah, I mean Rick does, but these are like for adults, they're not PG. Like why is everything wet? From the title they could tell it's a little bit. Well, there's a lot of raunchiness, but I like it. I was like no this story like this is my favorite one, but anyways, so yeah, so maybe that'll be next. We wrote the second one is kind of just like another moment of like visiting daddy at the police station. So we wrote a second one for kids called donuts at the station and my kids know the station as like the snack place, so that's. And I would assume, like other kids really maybe relate, and it was based on one one specific visit that my kids actually don't remember and I'm so bummed because, like they were, it's like their memories they're. It was just a couple years ago, I feel like, but they're like no, I don't remember that but Rick was working gangs and he had like a helicopter come and fly above us, which was so cool, you know, and like Rick was like yeah, it's my friend flying it, like how cool is that, you know, for kids. Yeah, and then was cool for me because we got to see like the Was it called? The booking the cells that they have in the station and I had never seen that. So I kind of talked about like touring the station. I guess in the book it's not quite as emotional, but but there's still little moments so I try to pull in there that are like, like at the end the mom tells the dad, like you know, be safe. And the kids like I wonder why, like why would she say that to daddy? And so again like maybe creating some like conversation starters for kids and their parents as they read it, so that one's brand new just came out. So but yeah, I think I think you're right, like other people have asked that too, so maybe next we'll work on something like that for older kids, that PG, pg, 13 Stories in there.

Speaker 1: 20:44

Yeah, I just think it'd be good to have some of those talking points before they maybe start running into more frequently, just through trainings and stuff that I've done, going out instructing and stuff like that. A lot of conversation recently has been coming up about Kids, right. However, how are the kids first responder, first responders handling things? And there's just not a lot of resources out there and for them. So I think this book would be like are these books you know would be good? And kind of like build maybe a little volume of? And this is. You know six through eight. This is good for. And then you know eight through eleven and you know just different areas of your life, that as your kid you're Encountering different things right at school especially.

Speaker 2: 21:36

Yeah, yeah, I agree, I know, and peers, like they always say like once your kids go to school, you're gonna lose your influence of what you have on them. So, yeah, I feel like for me, as an average gets to that age, like I'm learning more of like what he would need and the questions that he would ask. So, because I don't have a team yet, sort of hard for me to see that, but maybe as my kids grow I can like write for them kind of like I've been doing.

Speaker 1: 22:00

Yeah, so that's a good idea, yeah yeah, and do you want to talk a little bit more about your husband's book, like kind of just what he? It's a book about just things he's encountered throughout his career.

Speaker 2: 22:14

Yeah, yeah. So he kind of tells his story, which is like At first he wanted to write like a fiction type, but then everything was like this really happened to you, so it's not fiction. And then he, so he switched it and I do think like, yeah, so he, after he tells the story of like, kind of he starts off it's chronological, so like he's five, six years old, and like he sees his dad like Come home. Oh no, he tells his dad story. He tells his dad like, like stories that he knows about his work first, and then I think it's like the second chapter already, though Like he sees his dad being like wheeled into their living room and they had like a two-story apartment or house and His dad has to sleep in the living room because he can't like go up and down the stairs and he's all like puffed up and his heads all wrapped up, and but then he talks about like Going, like deciding to be a police officer and his mom didn't wanted him to do it. So he talks about that and like that's, his mom read the book and like it's very true, like she always wants them indoors, you know, in safe, which totally makes sense, because I'm all like, yeah, I would have been like if I happen to my husband, like no, but that is not what you're doing. And then, yeah, talk to his academy time and like two of his he's a very like introverted person that only has like two, three friends that he's known a million years and they are the same friends. So he talks about them like going through he went through the Academy with two guys he's still good friends with now and then working with them. And then, yeah, situations that like the why is everything? What is related to like just searching through people's backpack and like why is this always wet? And he dealt with some like Human trafficking. He one specific human trafficking victim that like really stayed with him and he tells her story. He did some like undercover work with Mafias and massage parlors, so he tells like all those kind of like gruesome stories. But I feel like people don't know this stuff and I feel like I call it like the underworlds, like oh my gosh, if people knew. This. Like this is like it's real, it's like a TV. You know, it's like not not like TV, because I feel like in TV they cram so much into like one hour right. This stuff is really happening and my husband's super passionate about like human trafficking and like people are not talking about this issue. That's so common. And then that they protect women because cops are given like a lot of slack for like doing not protecting women or women's rights. People get mad at them like but they do a lot of protecting of women. So he has a lot of stories about that. I feel like Because of his he mostly worked in gang units. So gang units they deal with them off the is in the gangs and there's a lot. Unfortunately bad treatment of women.

Speaker 1: 25:12

Who would like? Who's this book meant for to read?

Speaker 2: 25:15

I feel like police Families, like if I, if I other police wives could see their husbands in it. Probably if their husband so my husband's not a talker. So like literally reading this book I learned about him. So I felt like, even though their spouse didn't read it, like if they could see kind of what our officers grapple with. If their husband is like mine and doesn't talk a lot, that could help them. But I also think the general population. So my mom read it and then she was like can anyone read this? I have a friend that's kind of liberal, like can she read? It's like, yes, have her read it. And then like I would love to hear after she reads it. Like because I think it can open people's eyes to like what people actually go through. And then this personal experience of like a Rick being a generational police officer and his dad being, I feel like you can't not feel for him as a person at the beginning, as this Little boy you know who still chooses that career. Like that's crazy, you know. So I feel like anyone could read it really. But since I know best police wives and like our experience, I feel like they could, it could help them down more empathy, because sometimes we get resentful and I talk about that a lot like we're home a lot. We're home with the kids, you know we're the default parent and I struggle with that a lot at the beginning and I feel like over time, just learning him and like learning more about the job and the demands of the job and and the role that I needed to play in our family. Like I needed to be Okay, I needed to like accept that I am the default parent, like I am the one that's always gonna be there and create stability for a family. It's not gonna be him. It sounds so bad to say that so harsh but once you accept that, like the job, because of the job and the demands of it, he cannot be reliable help for me. So it sounds so harsh, but it's the truth.

Speaker 1: 27:05

It's true, it's doesn't mean he's not an incredible dad.

Speaker 2: 27:07

Nick is super active when he's home. Our boys love him, but yeah, it's like he can be called anytime, he can work overtime anytime, or so it's a lot on us once you accept that and kind of move forward. But I feel like, yeah, the book could help people like see those kind of things too. He talks our relationship issues because we dated on and off for 10 years. If we're getting married too, so it was like we'd be back together and then we wouldn't, because it's like oh, like, can you really commit to me? Are you like married to the job? Still like there's those sounds bad, but there's those things when you're first starting as a cop like really prioritizing it, and he was like that at the beginning.

Speaker 1: 27:47

So and maybe even for some of this, maybe looking in, to get in into law enforcement. It sounds like a good book for them to read.

Speaker 2: 27:56

Yeah, yeah, I hope so. Yeah, and I think, because I like that it talks about the personal part too, because, like, the job can consume you if you let it, you know. But I think it is better to have a little of a balance and have something outside of it so that when you have a, I feel like you hadn't. You had a recent episode that was about like fitness to and. Rick is avid, he loves working out and I always say it's his therapy, like a hundred percent, because he works out five, six days a week and at first I was resentful about that too, you know. I was like, oh, this is more time away from us. But like, eventually I went to his gym and I was like, okay, I get it like, and then he is happier. I could feel his little itch like if he, like, has not worked out for three days, I know you need to go tomorrow, like and get it's like his energy, get that energy out, whatever it is, because, like, he's not a talker and that took me a long time to learn to. I'm obviously a talker and I was like, why don't you stop these things out with me? No, that doesn't work for him, you know, and working out like seems to heal him, which is awesome.

Speaker 1: 29:03

So yeah, you have to in this line of work, you have to have that Outlet right and a lot of for a lot of first responders it's it's working out, and I have some different outlets too, but I do really love working out because he can it's that endorphin release those hormones and things and just like the it's Kind of like a meditation sometimes, depending on how you're working out like just to be in that, in that zone, in that space, and not to Worry about anything, right, I don't have to really worry about my safety and things like that. I feel like I'm in a safe place and can just Right, let things go.

Speaker 2: 29:40

Yeah, and he does jiu-jitsu to and cross and jiu-jitsu is good for work right.

Speaker 1: 29:46

Yeah you.

Speaker 2: 29:46

It's very practical. So our boys do. I feel like a hypocrite because I don't do it yet. I don't have time to prioritize myself. I feel like I could. My boys are like getting a little older where, like I could bring them with me maybe. But yeah, I totally believe in it, like seeing it, and he can observe like other officers. He's also getting older, see 42, and he feels like as he gets older he has to be even more in shape, like keep himself more in shape, because he used to potentially wrestle young, like 25 year old, 250-pound things, a muscle. Yeah so he'll say that, like, I feel like it's become even more important to him as he's gotten older to stay in shape and do jiu-jitsu, like where he can, if necessary, use his, his body.

Speaker 1: 30:31

So, yeah, yeah, no, I think you're right, those are both. It would be hard, right, for I could get that as a spouse being like You've gone already a lot and now you're going to work out, you're doing these things and you're taking more time away from your family, which is really tough decision, probably for him to make Too. But then on, you know, I also understand like I need to be in shape, I need to be physically fit For my job, to make sure I come home every day, you know, give myself the best, the best chance, and I think that's where the working out in the juice issue, of course, is perfect for law enforcement, you know. But so this is he's doing that. He's still Getting out there and doing those things and still feel motivated about doing them, which is great. It's a little bit harder as you get older into your career.

Speaker 2: 31:19

Yeah, injuries, so like in 2020, in addition to like the co vid and police hate and all that stuff, like he was actually literally the day that it was national, it became a national emergency. Kobe was announced. It was announced while he was getting surgery on his back because of an incident at work. Um, so he was out on IOD like most that time. Oh, that was a lot for me. I'm like all of a sudden, like my, I teach and my classes went online. My kids were home and Rick's laying in bed like recovering. It was like so hard, but anyway. So then, um, he recovered and I like he's recovered even better than he was before. Like was so good, but, um, he broke his baby toe. So it means you just feel like in a jujitsu class, maybe, like you know, six months, like after recovering and I Was not. He will tell you like I was so mean about it. I did not feel bad for him. I was like no, I'm pretty sure like in our bow is it was like one every five years you can be injured, so yeah, so injuries occur as well and like, yeah, you think like toe is not a big deal like yet it were a boot forever.

Speaker 1: 32:27

Yeah, yeah, something that seems so little, it can be life, life changing.

Speaker 2: 32:33

Yeah, yeah, and I should have been nicer, but I kind of wasn't.

Speaker 1: 32:36

I was like no.

Speaker 2: 32:38

I'm done helping you, you know, and luckily, I mean, you recovered from that too. But yeah, there's, and he'll come home. It's like black eyes from jujitsu. I'm like what is that fight club? Like what are you going to? But he loves it, so whatever works, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 32:54

Yeah, do you think writing the book for him just you know, kind of speaking for him was a little bit therapeutic?

Speaker 2: 33:00

Yeah, yeah, it's totally like. So I said we had lost his dad and he started writing it after that and like A thousand percent, like I think it was therapeutic for him, especially because he's not a talker, and I thought, oh my gosh, like that book makes me laugh and cry, like he's a good writer too, and so obviously I'm biased. But I think there are like relatable moments for other people that are police families for sure, and I hope even at like the general public reading it too, like seen police as like people and so, yeah, I hope I think it was for sure, yeah the.

Speaker 1: 33:39

What can people find on your website? Do you have?

Speaker 2: 33:43

So most of my I have a blog on there and, like most of the blogs that are right or for police wives like and Tips for them for all different kinds of like if, like, I have a general one that's like for police wives, I also have one that, like dating a cop is, it is a keyword that gets a lot of searches. Let me tell you so. I have an article on dating a cop and that one gets the most views out of anything. But dating is hard in general. So I totally guarantee and in that one I just talk about like things that are normal, that you wouldn't know right until you date one. You're like, oh, they work a lot and they work weird hours, and like they're maybe they're not able to like date you a lot Because of their crazy schedule. And then even their days off like I always joke like that first day off ricks good for nothing. It's recovering.

Speaker 1: 34:26

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 34:27

Yeah, but those are little things. So I like try to talk about those in that one. And then I have like one that is in my kind of like police wife 101, so like being married to an officer and kind of what's normal. Um. And then I have like specific ones about like resentment, the holidays and dealing with holidays and like kind of how, um, I've been able to Like create traditions anyway, even though maybe we're not, maybe ricks, not home on Christmas or Christmas Eve or whatever, but like we always do other things throughout the month that are like traditions for our family that we could still keep up every year. So kind of just how to adapt your life to this lifestyle and still be joyful. Um. And I have ones like how I like went on. I went on it. We had a triple date, like a double date, but like with three couples planned, rick got scheduled to work and like I went anyway. So I like talk about those kinds of things where it's like this these are things that you could choose to stay home or you just choose to go and be like this is who I am and like I can still have a happy marriage, but unfortunately my husband has to work tonight, you know. So I share those kinds of things. I hope like I wouldn't have known, like no one had told me when I was early on dating or married to rick.

Speaker 1: 35:36

That would have helped me, I hope so right knowing is Will allow you to probably have a more successful relationship right. Yeah and I think, having those resources to reach out to and reading about them and then formulating what's going to work in our relationship, having those resources to spark those ideas or conversation Because, like you said, dating someone that works a crazy schedule like that is you I'm sure it was really frustrating for you.

Speaker 2: 36:09

Yeah, like I said, we dated a long time. I think Rick also wanted to wait until he was fully financially stable and his career was stable Before he got married. So I want to clarify that too. And we met when I was 17,. He's 21. So we're pretty young, but a lot of people do get married young. But we didn't, yeah. So I think like every time we would kind of start dating again. It was hard Because also I was it wasn't just him I was traveling, like I was going to college for a long time, to grad school, and like wasn't living in LA. So we're always long distance too.

Speaker 1: 36:40

So I just want to clarify that.

Speaker 2: 36:42

But I think because of his schedule isn't like normal, it's not like he would have weekends off. We're like, oh, we could see each other on the weekends. Like nope, he was probably working weekends and then my schedule was opposite, working like Monday through Friday. So yeah, it really is hard, you know, to like how are you actually going to see each other and like build up that relationship? So luckily, we just knew each other for a long time. Like I always say, we were friends, like we're like, he's like my best friends were friends and that always like was the glue, that like kept us coming back to each other and then eventually being like, all right, we should just Finally asked me to marry him. I was like, ok, let's do this thing.

Speaker 1: 37:20

That's great. I'm glad he did. Yeah, do you do you write anything like for someone that that's dating, let's say, a police officer, and then they go to or maybe wants to be a police officer, and then they go to the police academy and there's some of that the content you write deal with, like, hey, now I got a big live change, I'm going to the police academy. This is maybe what you should expect you write about that type of stuff too.

Speaker 2: 37:46

Yeah, I have one on the academy and then even probation, because so in the academy article I talk about probation because no one's searching for probation Like on Google or whatever. But Rick actually says probation was harder and the nature is probation stories in his book and they are like their old school. So I don't know if people are treated like they are now. You know, like where they used to be. Yeah, but yeah, so I have an article on that and then I also for a little bit I did YouTube but I talked. I had like a video on YouTube about that too. So, yeah, because I had the transition and also like in LA they do come home at the end of the day. So that's a little bit different than like I've heard some of the other. Like sheriff's departments are smaller, they go and stay for like months. That's different than what we experienced. So, but also just because they come home I have this article like doesn't mean they can be helpful. Like they're exhausted, they're tired. Rick used to like and he talked about this in his book like he wasn't the best you know, like he needed to get in better physical shape, Like he could shoot, but he needed to get better physical shape and studying for the exams, Like. So he would go in early and work out with his now best friend and he like helped him get in shape and work out after. So yeah, just because you think they're going to come home, like they might not be very helpful. So I talk about like as a police wife or girlfriend. You know, maybe during that time it's a season. So like ask me for help, you know, and like I feel like asking for help has really helped me as a mom and it could be a happier, happier wife. Like there have been times where we've held like a housekeeper come once a month and clean the house and then daycare, Like that one, we tried to juggle no daycare after having Maverick, our first son, for the first year. That seemed like looking back because I work. If he works in, we were like, oh, it's fine, he works in the night, I worked during the day. Like well, when were we going to sleep? Like what were we thinking? But also like I think trust is a big thing for police families of like not having they don't. People don't want to hire babysitters or professional daycare because they don't trust other people. I feel like we've been lucky to find people that we trust, but usually it's like through referral of other friends or something that have somebody. But yeah, once we did that, I felt like I could breathe again. I was like because Rick would get his working nights and he was supposed to come home, you know, like five, five am or something you know, and I'd like hand the baby off to him and I'd go teach or something. But then he'd be like oh, I have overtime today, oh like, and I would be so mad at him, you know, and it's like that's out of his control. So yeah, I try to tell people these things I've learned and I hope it helps them. Like, just know you're going to need help. You cannot depend on them to be home at a certain time to help. So then you can breathe if you have like a safe place to take your child while you work or you need to go do whatever it is.

Speaker 1: 40:37

So yeah, yeah, and I think those are great things to write about and think about and prepare for, because I think I know a few people that tried to do that. Like I'm coming home, you know, let's pass off the kids and then you're leaving, and I think for I don't know maybe people might be a little bit easier from nine, nine, we'll come nine to five years. They may be more consistent schedule, but gosh, you just really never know what you're going to be stuck with at work and how long you're going to be there and when you're going to be called back. And I just couldn't even imagine trying to juggle all that early on. Yeah, it wasn't smart, Like you know it was not the best decision.

Speaker 2: 41:18

And then just I remember like leaving my voice. So we found this home daycare that like a girlfriend of mine, her son had started there and I went and toward it and it was, it was a home. Like this woman ran it, she was so loving, and then she also. I'm kind of like OCD and I had like a schedule for my kids and she kind of did that too. It's not like crazy schedule, but like a routine or whatever. And I was like wow, she's like me, you know, and Maverick went there like pretty much he just went to preschool the last year, when he's four, and it was like he was there three years before. I can't do the math, it's like a while. And yeah, I still think of her and I'm so thankful, you know, to have had that safe place. So I want everyone to know they're out there. Like help is out there or housekeepers. People are nervous so people come in their house. But you know, if you get like a referral from a friend or something like, those things can just create so much sanity for your life. I love my robot vacuum, like I like a little thing, but like that little thing brings me so much joy because it's helpful. I don't feel guilty about it, like I'm not paying something every month. I bought it one time. It's been working for a couple of years now. It's been amazing and it's like so silly. But these little things like can be so helpful and you need help. You know, like that's normal. I think it's hard. I feel like a lot of women, like I say this to where we're kind of trained to be passive, so we're not good at voicing what we need and then we think our spouse knows. Of course they know I'm stressed right now. Of course they know. You know, and a girlfriend of mine said this to me she's like, she's like I don't know how my husband can't look at me and my hair is a mess and I haven't done my makeup and he's just like how was your day? And I was like, have you seen me Like? And I was like, no, like you're beautiful. And he doesn't see that, like he doesn't. You need to tell him like I'm stressed out, I need help, but he can't always be the help. And I think he's like I don't know, but he can't always be the help. And I think, like that's where the resentment comes in. But if you have other professional help or some other help, some people are lucky enough to have family around or whatever. But then you won't feel that towards him anymore because you have, like, your needs met, you know. But yeah, it took me a long time to like get myself there of like voicing and accepting that I needed help, and it's not always going to be Rick that can do it.

Speaker 1: 43:29

So yeah, that resentment will kill our relationship, right?

Speaker 2: 43:33

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 43:35

Really really fast. And I think you're right. You know, having that help or setting up routines and things like that can help you not have maybe as much resentment. I mean, I think there's going to be a little resentment for most people towards the job, right, because, like, I can't count on you for anything and we never know what our life is going to be like, and I would understand that, right, they have to have a little bit of resentment for that because you just I just want a normal life.

Speaker 2: 44:08

Yeah, yeah, I know my husband was like I think you still do get annoyed, yeah, because lately I'll have his schedule and then they'll just like switch some of the weekdays and then it's like he doesn't find out until the day before. I was like, how do they not? No, okay, I. So yeah, I still get, sure, yeah. I was like I think that's normal, because I thought you're going to be off tomorrow or whatever and now you're not, and in my head I have this vision of how the day is going to go, you know like, and now it's not. So to wrap my head around that for a minute, you know so yeah, it was still happens for sure, but that's disappointing, right, You're disappointed.

Speaker 1: 44:48

that that's, that's fair to be disappointed when you're expecting him to be off and and he's not, I think maybe there's some learning lessons on the other person's side. Right Would have like oh yeah, I'm sorry. Right, I know you had plans like maybe acknowledging acknowledging that instead of just internalizing it.

Speaker 2: 45:10

Yeah, yeah, I agree, and I think that, like Rick has come around to like he acknowledges, like my role in the family and that I think a lot of people, they just think like well, you're just home, you're just with the kids, like it's no big deal, you know, like it's easy because we're home. And I think you know Rick was, I'd rather be home, he would rather be home, and he jokes like he would love to be a stay home dad. He's like, why don't you go get promoted? I'm like no, thank you. So, um, yeah, so, and maybe he would be fantastic at it and the kids listen to him more, so might be easier. But, yeah, I think, I think he does, like he'll acknowledge and he tries to, like he'll do like laundry and he helps when he's home, like so it's not like he's just like, oh, I'm sorry, it's not like he's just like home and he's off and he's doing nothing. Like yeah. So I think that that helps too. Like I've heard other other place, I say, like their husbands don't do anything at all, like how it's work wise and that you know I don't need them to do everything, but like it's nice that he tries to chip in because we're both when we're both home, we're both here, like we both need to contribute. And when you have kids it helps too because, like if your husband's an active father, like all like be cooking or cleaning up the kitchen, and like Rick's going to go like help the boys take a bath or whatever. So I feel like that kind of it kind of helps to equalize things. Once you have kids, if, if they're helpful, yeah, the housework or cleaning, cooking, whatever.

Speaker 1: 46:36

So and by no means thinking a stay a home parent is is easy. I can do it. I can do it even today. Probably I could do it for a while, but I would be happy about it.

Speaker 2: 46:54

I know I actually I mean we'd have to change our life self. I did it because I work, but I'm a professor, so I have like a teacher schedule, so it's the best mom job in the world and I'm very thankful. And there are things that come up after the kids get out of school, but I'm usually able to like go and pick them up and then I'll have like a zoom meeting or something after, but it's really like the best job I could have. I feel like so yeah, I feel like eventually they go to school. So I always I worked hard for my degrees and to get my job, so it was like I can't just leave it. So I and it does give. I feel like for me, when I'm home during the summer, like with them, I'm kind of ready to go back, like I'm ready to have something that is different than just like being home with them all day, even though I love them. It's good to have like a little diversity in your life of things, and if you're just home all day, I think that is hard, you know, to just do that all day and I would probably ask Rick for more time, like if I was to stay at home. Mom of like I need to go and like have some me time, because I naturally kind of get it with work. even though it's work is still I enjoy it, so it's okay.

Speaker 1: 47:58

Yeah, I stay in. Staying home parent is really difficult. I would like I said I would never underestimate the sacrifice, right, Just like you're talking, the sacrifice of having your education, your degrees and things like that, and then wanting to probably when they go to school, like now, I can get out there and do some of the things that I wanted to do because there was a lot of sacrifice early on in the relationship. So like that's not not uncommon, right? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 48:28

yeah, that's true. Yeah, I was thinking about like routines and like routines are so good for families. And one thing I had to ask Rick because, like, when he's home is different. So if he's home like it's funny, always mornings, because even when he works day shift, he's like gone before we get up and then if he was working nice, he's asleep. So, like mornings are like me and the boys consistently for like ever since we had our kids, and then nights kind of are like when he's gone. Like it's like I have my routine of, like the way he thinks of the boys. And then I kind of had to tell him like I need you to support my routine, like the way I do it, because if not, then if you do one thing differently, like your kids remember it and they're like well, daddy, let me do this way last night. So so I think that like that's something that like boundary wise, like if you are responsible for like the home life most of the time, the majority of the time, like it's okay to ask for your spouse to support your routine that you create so that they can have their sanity the next night when you're not there, whatever it is.

Speaker 1: 49:29

So yeah, you're totally right, kids are great. You, you break the routine one time. Now that's the new routine for all the times and I like the way you put it to like support you know the whatever the home parents routine is. But that is really difficult to come home and do because sometimes you feel like at least for me, I came home and I'd feel like a visitor, stranger in my own house, type of type of thing. But that should be on me right to support that routine. It's just sometimes with those crazy work schedules, like what is the routine? This is the routine because I'm home, so I'm dictating the routine, right?

Speaker 2: 50:11

Yeah, yeah, no, I think that's at a good point too, and like, obviously things are different. Like Rick is like rowdy or with the boys and like, and there's like a high energy when he comes home too and I think every police I've could relate to that like, oh my gosh, like daddy's home, and I'm excited too because, like maybe I haven't spoken to another adult all day, so we can't, or whatever, and even my work, like if I just have like a research day, like I don't know with myself all day, or in summer, just talk to the kids all day and like it's so exciting. So we're all just like, like talking to you off. So like, obviously things do change when Rick is home, naturally, but like, I guess more like the schedule is what I'm talking about, like and like not rallying them up like right before bed, because that's like a bad thing, that's really common. But you're right, it's like, it is special. I'm probably feel special to him to like be here, so, and he's told me that too, he's like this is all that I know. Yeah like because I'll be, like, it's weird, you're special, and he's like, no, it's, this is all that I know, and all this fear is no, so it's like, this is the life he's living and yeah, so that's it. We have to have empathy for that too, for sure.

Speaker 1: 51:19

Yeah, and maybe maybe the answer is kind of just sitting down and like this is this is the routine that we're going to be doing for the next few months because Maverick's playing sports, right, or whatever, and so we got to adjust to the routine, and this is I'm big on routines too. It just kind of helps everybody know what's expected and maybe it helps the kids not be like I don't have to ask them a bunch of times really to do a bunch of things, because this is the routine right Time, bath time, right, say, the clock, whatever. Yeah, that's, that's the routine. I don't need to ask you 10 times because you're right now.

Speaker 2: 51:56

So yeah, yeah, I agree, yeah, and I think that it's just mostly for me personally, it's like the schedule of like when is bedtime and stuff like that. So because, yeah, sometimes he's wanted it earlier and I'm like, no, it's kind of funny, like that's the opposite of what people would want. Probably, like most of the young moms wouldn't mind earlier. But yeah, I don't know Like we and we our kids do kind of go to bed early already. I feel like eight is like their bedtime and that's kind of. Our youngest one is actually crazier and he's like he's gonna be a night shift person someday, Like he's like still reading till like 10. I mean he's funny, so. But Rick thinks like if they calm down earlier, then they'll like then our littlest one would go to sleep by eight, but anyway. So yeah, I think I don't know what I'm saying with that.

Speaker 1: 52:41

Yeah, it really comes down as the communication and in the relationship and sometimes the space like you're talking about, of. I think transitions are really hard really for first responders. The transition to going to work, transition to come home, maybe it's a transition to like going to do overtime or doing a specialty assignments, those all come with just different changes in life, almost like the body chemistry. Right, I'm going to work, so I'm already mentally prepared. And then when I come home, how do I like hurry up and down regularly to like interact with the family and act like my day was, you know, was nothing, you know, I was watching I can't remember his name, but like he was showing a video or talking about a gentleman who was trying to rest another person and they're wrestling and fighting and he had to pull out his gun, you know, and then so then three hours he gets off and he's supposed to come home via like a loving husband.

Speaker 2: 53:45

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 53:46

So like those transitions are really hard and you have to like be good right at making those transitions for a smooth home life.

Speaker 2: 53:57

I know and there is a term that is a military term that I found I wrote a blog about. I'm trying to find the term now Let me see if.

Speaker 3: 54:04

I can find it.

Speaker 2: 54:05

It describes that it's a military term, but I was like no, we go through it too, and we go through it like every day.

Speaker 1: 54:11

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 54:11

Yeah, so there's a term for that.

Speaker 1: 54:15

And military deployments right, probably a little bit different, like that's. Those transitions are longer in a way and maybe you can be prepared and you know, for those transitions and but yeah, I think that's that sets the tone. When a spouse is going to work, those transitions are coming home.

Speaker 2: 54:36

Yeah, so it's called reintegration. Oh yeah, it's a little intense maybe for us, but I do think it's like especially, maybe even that first day back home, like because you're gone three to five days or something or longer if you're like fire, but her police is like three to five days, and then that first day home it's like, you know, everything is a little different and sometimes I'll forget, like that Rick's going to be off and I like schedule this stuff and he's introvert and that is not his favorite thing at all. And then, like you're right that he went through all this, he went through all this stuff. That like he's not a talker, so sometimes I don't have a clue, like right, so but yeah, and I think working out, he'll work out. It depends on his shift, but like if it's day shift, like on the way home, so then he has that, like that drive also he drives pretty far. We live in like a suburb of LA, so we'll have the long drive and working out, and then he's coming. So that helps, you know, yeah, I might judge that time like, oh, that's more time away, it's like, nope, that helps him to come home and be like moved on a little bit from whatever happened.

Speaker 1: 55:44

Yeah, yeah, definitely probably a little happier, little healthier. The drive time right. This you know. Once again, driving can be like a meditation to a relaxing thing. But I mean, if you live in a suburb of LA, it's probably not relaxing at all to drive anywhere.

Speaker 2: 55:59

I know, I think that podcast helped now. I think that like that's kind of a nice thing. That's not like that new, but like that would help. Or like listening to books. He's listened to like so many books, so he listened to like that Elon Musk when I just started, that too. But yeah, so I think, if you have to, that long drive like doing some kind of listening to something peaceful, because, yeah, driving is not necessarily relaxing, but yeah, we choose, he wants to live out here too, like so it's, then he's like. He says he can relax when he's home you know, that's good stress that like helps him with his boundaries.

Speaker 1: 56:35

So yeah, chris. And where can people follow you and find you and get more information about what you're doing?

Speaker 2: 56:43

So I'm always active on Instagram at heels and holster all one like blended word and then it's www dot. Heels and holstercom is my blog and then I do send out like a weekly email. So if you're not like an Instagram person, I send out like a weekly email that's relevant to like whatever, like the holidays right now or something like that. That's relevant for police wives and I do have fire wives that follow me or other first responder wives, but I usually use that term police wife because I have learned like fire is so different to like. I've learned from fellow fire wives it's a different reality so I don't want to pretend like I totally understand that you know.

Speaker 1: 57:22

Yeah, there's definitely a lot of a lot of crossover and it's the same and there's definitely some things that are there are different. Well, thank you so much for being on today and thank you for what you're doing. I think those books are great and I appreciate you know your husband writing a book and then it sounds like it was very therapeutic for him.

Speaker 2: 57:40

Yeah, yeah, thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1: 57:43

Yeah, oh, but before I let you go, you have these books are available on Amazon, is that correct?

Speaker 2: 57:48

Yes.

Speaker 1: 57:49

Okay, just wanted that audience to make sure that go check those books out. I thank you.

Speaker 3: 57:54

Thanks again for listening. Don't forget to rate and review the show wherever you access your podcast. If you know someone that would be great on the show, please get a hold of our host, jerry Dean Lund, through the Instagram handles at Jerry fire and fuel or at enduring the badge podcast, also by visiting the show's website in during the badge podcastcom for additional methods of contact and up to date information regarding show. Remember the views and opinions expressed during the show, so we represent those of our hosts and the current episodes. Guest.